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Latest newsletter from SourceForge re: AOO

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marcpare4

Latest newsletter from SourceForge re: AOO

FYI (for those who are interested) -- From the latest SourceForge newsletter

"Fastest Growing Projects
Each month I get a report of the fastest growing projects for the month.
Often, they contain an equal mix of familiar and new. This usually means
that the familiar projects have pushed out a new release, and that the
new projects have been discovered by a new audience.

This month, these are the top ten growth projects:

Apache OpenOffice: A wonderful multiplatform and multilingual office suite.

KeePass Password Safe: KeePass - A free open source password manager.

aMSN: MSN compatible messenger application. ..."

Cheers,

Marc

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Charles-H. Schulz

Re: Latest newsletter from SourceForge re: AOO

Marc,

The brand name and the automatic upda notification do help, obviously.

Best,

Charles.
Le 17 juin 2012 11:05, "Marc Paré" <[hidden email]> a écrit :

> FYI (for those who are interested) -- From the latest SourceForge
> newsletter
>
> "Fastest Growing Projects
> Each month I get a report of the fastest growing projects for the month.
> Often, they contain an equal mix of familiar and new. This usually means
> that the familiar projects have pushed out a new release, and that the new
> projects have been discovered by a new audience.
>
> This month, these are the top ten growth projects:
>
> Apache OpenOffice: A wonderful multiplatform and multilingual office suite.
>
> KeePass Password Safe: KeePass - A free open source password manager.
>
> aMSN: MSN compatible messenger application. ..."
>
> Cheers,
>
> Marc
>
>
> --
> Unsubscribe instructions: E-mail to marketing+help@global.**
> libreoffice.org <marketing%[hidden email]>
> Problems? http://www.libreoffice.org/**get-help/mailing-lists/how-to-**
> unsubscribe/<http://www.libreoffice.org/get-help/mailing-lists/how-to-unsubscribe/>
> Posting guidelines + more: http://wiki.**documentfoundation.org/**
> Netiquette <http://wiki.documentfoundation.org/Netiquette>
> List archive: http://listarchives.**libreoffice.org/global/**marketing/<http://listarchives.libreoffice.org/global/marketing/>
> All messages sent to this list will be publicly archived and cannot be
> deleted
>
>

timofonic timofonic

Re: Latest newsletter from SourceForge re: AOO

So why not add the automatic update notification to LibreOffice too?
Just like Google Chrome and such too would be interesting for network
connected computers.

On Sun, Jun 17, 2012 at 1:49 PM, Charles-H. Schulz
<[hidden email]> wrote:

> Marc,
>
> The brand name and the automatic upda notification do help, obviously.
>
> Best,
>
> Charles.
> Le 17 juin 2012 11:05, "Marc Paré" <[hidden email]> a écrit :
>
>> FYI (for those who are interested) -- From the latest SourceForge
>> newsletter
>>
>> "Fastest Growing Projects
>> Each month I get a report of the fastest growing projects for the month.
>> Often, they contain an equal mix of familiar and new. This usually means
>> that the familiar projects have pushed out a new release, and that the new
>> projects have been discovered by a new audience.
>>
>> This month, these are the top ten growth projects:
>>
>> Apache OpenOffice: A wonderful multiplatform and multilingual office suite.
>>
>> KeePass Password Safe: KeePass - A free open source password manager.
>>
>> aMSN: MSN compatible messenger application. ..."
>>
>> Cheers,
>>
>> Marc
>>
>>
>> --
>> Unsubscribe instructions: E-mail to marketing+help@global.**
>> libreoffice.org <marketing%[hidden email]>
>> Problems? http://www.libreoffice.org/**get-help/mailing-lists/how-to-**
>> unsubscribe/<http://www.libreoffice.org/get-help/mailing-lists/how-to-unsubscribe/>
>> Posting guidelines + more: http://wiki.**documentfoundation.org/**
>> Netiquette <http://wiki.documentfoundation.org/Netiquette>
>> List archive: http://listarchives.**libreoffice.org/global/**marketing/<http://listarchives.libreoffice.org/global/marketing/>
>> All messages sent to this list will be publicly archived and cannot be
>> deleted
>>
>>
>
> --
> Unsubscribe instructions: E-mail to [hidden email]
> Problems? http://www.libreoffice.org/get-help/mailing-lists/how-to-unsubscribe/
> Posting guidelines + more: http://wiki.documentfoundation.org/Netiquette
> List archive: http://listarchives.libreoffice.org/global/marketing/
> All messages sent to this list will be publicly archived and cannot be deleted
>

Charles-H. Schulz

Re: Latest newsletter from SourceForge re: AOO

We do have it now, but not on the old openoffice 3.3 versions. AOO controls
the dns of openoffice.org domain, and can hence push the notifications.

Best,
Charles.
Le 17 juin 2012 13:54, "timofonic timofonic" <[hidden email]> a écrit :

> So why not add the automatic update notification to LibreOffice too?
> Just like Google Chrome and such too would be interesting for network
> connected computers.
>
> On Sun, Jun 17, 2012 at 1:49 PM, Charles-H. Schulz
> <[hidden email]> wrote:
> > Marc,
> >
> > The brand name and the automatic upda notification do help, obviously.
> >
> > Best,
> >
> > Charles.
> > Le 17 juin 2012 11:05, "Marc Paré" <[hidden email]> a écrit :
> >
> >> FYI (for those who are interested) -- From the latest SourceForge
> >> newsletter
> >>
> >> "Fastest Growing Projects
> >> Each month I get a report of the fastest growing projects for the month.
> >> Often, they contain an equal mix of familiar and new. This usually means
> >> that the familiar projects have pushed out a new release, and that the
> new
> >> projects have been discovered by a new audience.
> >>
> >> This month, these are the top ten growth projects:
> >>
> >> Apache OpenOffice: A wonderful multiplatform and multilingual office
> suite.
> >>
> >> KeePass Password Safe: KeePass - A free open source password manager.
> >>
> >> aMSN: MSN compatible messenger application. ..."
> >>
> >> Cheers,
> >>
> >> Marc
> >>
> >>
> >> --
> >> Unsubscribe instructions: E-mail to marketing+help@global.**
> >> libreoffice.org <marketing%[hidden email]>
> >> Problems? http://www.libreoffice.org/**get-help/mailing-lists/how-to-**
> >> unsubscribe/<
> http://www.libreoffice.org/get-help/mailing-lists/how-to-unsubscribe/>
> >> Posting guidelines + more: http://wiki.**documentfoundation.org/**
> >> Netiquette <http://wiki.documentfoundation.org/Netiquette>
> >> List archive: http://listarchives.**libreoffice.org/global/**marketing/
> <http://listarchives.libreoffice.org/global/marketing/>
> >> All messages sent to this list will be publicly archived and cannot be
> >> deleted
> >>
> >>
> >
> > --
> > Unsubscribe instructions: E-mail to
> [hidden email]
> > Problems?
> http://www.libreoffice.org/get-help/mailing-lists/how-to-unsubscribe/
> > Posting guidelines + more: http://wiki.documentfoundation.org/Netiquette
> > List archive: http://listarchives.libreoffice.org/global/marketing/
> > All messages sent to this list will be publicly archived and cannot be
> deleted
> >
>
> --
> Unsubscribe instructions: E-mail to [hidden email]
> Problems?
> http://www.libreoffice.org/get-help/mailing-lists/how-to-unsubscribe/
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> List archive: http://listarchives.libreoffice.org/global/marketing/
> All messages sent to this list will be publicly archived and cannot be
> deleted
>

krackedpress

Re: Latest newsletter from SourceForge re: AOO

In reply to this post by Charles-H. Schulz

Is it true that AOO is not going to have the same numbering system for
its version, like LO is using? I have seen "advertisements" for AOO in
articles that talk about AOO v4. If they skip all of the 3's and go to
the version name "4", then it may look like LO is behind them, when it
was LO who moved far ahead of them in the past year.

Could there be a system setup where you collect email addresses to send
out a notice for the next release of LO, or maybe add some simple
function where if there is access to the Internet, it would look online
for what version is available and tell the user that there is a new
version out for them to try? It could be performed once a week,
bi-weekly, or monthly. You would have to have both a function as part
of LO and a data file online that shows which version are currently in
final release.

For those of you that use the latest version of Linux, I hope your
repositories will reflect the newest LO version within a month of the
release. I still use Ubuntu 10.04 on most of my systems, so its
repository still used the old OOo 3.x as its default office package. I
do have a Ubuntu 12.04/MATE install on a laptop, but I do not use it often.

On 06/17/2012 07:49 AM, Charles-H. Schulz wrote:

> Marc,
>
> The brand name and the automatic upda notification do help, obviously.
>
> Best,
>
> Charles.
> Le 17 juin 2012 11:05, "Marc Paré"<[hidden email]> a écrit :
>
>> FYI (for those who are interested) -- From the latest SourceForge
>> newsletter
>>
>> "Fastest Growing Projects
>> Each month I get a report of the fastest growing projects for the month.
>> Often, they contain an equal mix of familiar and new. This usually means
>> that the familiar projects have pushed out a new release, and that the new
>> projects have been discovered by a new audience.
>>
>> This month, these are the top ten growth projects:
>>
>> Apache OpenOffice: A wonderful multiplatform and multilingual office suite.
>>
>> KeePass Password Safe: KeePass - A free open source password manager.
>>
>> aMSN: MSN compatible messenger application. ..."
>>
>> Cheers,
>>
>> Marc
>>
>>
>> --
>> Unsubscribe instructions: E-mail to marketing+help@global.**
>> libreoffice.org<marketing%[hidden email]>
>> Problems? http://www.libreoffice.org/**get-help/mailing-lists/how-to-**
>> unsubscribe/<http://www.libreoffice.org/get-help/mailing-lists/how-to-unsubscribe/>
>> Posting guidelines + more: http://wiki.**documentfoundation.org/**
>> Netiquette<http://wiki.documentfoundation.org/Netiquette>
>> List archive: http://listarchives.**libreoffice.org/global/**marketing/<http://listarchives.libreoffice.org/global/marketing/>
>> All messages sent to this list will be publicly archived and cannot be
>> deleted
>>
>>

timofonic timofonic

Re: Latest newsletter from SourceForge re: AOO

Obviously, AOSS has the obvious corporatocracy advantages of the big
ones. They will play with marketing tricks all the time, because big
corps are hypocrite and want to destroy Free Software in a parasite
way and consider non-bsd copyleft (GPL, LGPL...) as the enemy to
monopolies and they are really true.

So the best way of LibreOffice to fight is to show it's a lot better
project, able to satisfy a very wider audience that even may not be
commercially interesting for big corps. I say not just features, but
also getting it optimized to run on low end platforms (or old
computers) and others.

Another good thing is to make a code sharing alliance with other
copyleft office suites or word processors, specially in the matter of
file format support. This way, more people would collaborate on having
an *A LOT* better support of Microsoft Office file formats (for
example).

LibreOffice competitors aren't just Microsoft Office, but AOO and
other office suites and word processors. So forces should be joined,
to make the free software office suite and word processing ecosystem
stronger.

Of course, guerrilla marketing is the best way. Worldwide meetings,
collaboration with NGOs, free LibreOffice courses...

On Sun, Jun 17, 2012 at 3:33 PM, webmaster-Kracked_P_P
<[hidden email]> wrote:

>
> Is it true that AOO is not going to have the same numbering system for its
> version, like LO is using? I have seen "advertisements" for AOO in articles
> that talk about AOO v4. If they skip all of the 3's and go to the version
> name "4", then it may look like LO is behind them, when it was LO who moved
> far ahead of them in the past year.
>
> Could there be a system setup where you collect email addresses to send out
> a notice for the next release of LO, or maybe add some simple function where
> if there is access to the Internet, it would look online for what version is
> available and tell the user that there is a new version out for them to try?
> It could be performed once a week, bi-weekly, or monthly. You would have
> to have both a function as part of LO and a data file online that shows
> which version are currently in final release.
>
> For those of you that use the latest version of Linux, I hope your
> repositories will reflect the newest LO version within a month of the
> release. I still use Ubuntu 10.04 on most of my systems, so its repository
> still used the old OOo 3.x as its default office package. I do have a
> Ubuntu 12.04/MATE install on a laptop, but I do not use it often.
>
>
>
>
> On 06/17/2012 07:49 AM, Charles-H. Schulz wrote:
>>
>> Marc,
>>
>> The brand name and the automatic upda notification do help, obviously.
>>
>> Best,
>>
>> Charles.
>> Le 17 juin 2012 11:05, "Marc Paré"<[hidden email]> a écrit :
>>
>>> FYI (for those who are interested) -- From the latest SourceForge
>>> newsletter
>>>
>>> "Fastest Growing Projects
>>> Each month I get a report of the fastest growing projects for the month.
>>> Often, they contain an equal mix of familiar and new. This usually means
>>> that the familiar projects have pushed out a new release, and that the
>>> new
>>> projects have been discovered by a new audience.
>>>
>>> This month, these are the top ten growth projects:
>>>
>>> Apache OpenOffice: A wonderful multiplatform and multilingual office
>>> suite.
>>>
>>> KeePass Password Safe: KeePass - A free open source password manager.
>>>
>>> aMSN: MSN compatible messenger application. ..."
>>>
>>> Cheers,
>>>
>>> Marc
>>>
>>>
>>> --
>>> Unsubscribe instructions: E-mail to marketing+help@global.**
>>> libreoffice.org<marketing%[hidden email]>
>>> Problems? http://www.libreoffice.org/**get-help/mailing-lists/how-to-**
>>>
>>> unsubscribe/<http://www.libreoffice.org/get-help/mailing-lists/how-to-unsubscribe/>
>>> Posting guidelines + more: http://wiki.**documentfoundation.org/**
>>> Netiquette<http://wiki.documentfoundation.org/Netiquette>
>>> List archive:
>>> http://listarchives.**libreoffice.org/global/**marketing/<http://listarchives.libreoffice.org/global/marketing/>
>>> All messages sent to this list will be publicly archived and cannot be
>>> deleted
>>>
>>>
>
>
> --
> Unsubscribe instructions: E-mail to [hidden email]
> Problems?
> http://www.libreoffice.org/get-help/mailing-lists/how-to-unsubscribe/
> Posting guidelines + more: http://wiki.documentfoundation.org/Netiquette
> List archive: http://listarchives.libreoffice.org/global/marketing/
> All messages sent to this list will be publicly archived and cannot be
> deleted
>

Charles-H. Schulz

Re: Latest newsletter from SourceForge re: AOO

In reply to this post by krackedpress

Le dimanche 17 juin 2012 à 09:33 -0400, webmaster-Kracked_P_P a écrit :
> Is it true that AOO is not going to have the same numbering system for
> its version, like LO is using? I have seen "advertisements" for AOO in
> articles that talk about AOO v4. If they skip all of the 3's and go to
> the version name "4", then it may look like LO is behind them, when it
> was LO who moved far ahead of them in the past year.

It is true that AOO 4 is scheduled to be their next release with
Symphony being used as the base. Which basically turns everything upside
down again (since they could have used Symphony from the beginning, but
hey, better use the OpenOffice.org trademark and the magical
"community") , but will have the great benefit of separating clearly AOO
and LibreOffice. In the end I think that's for the best.

>
> Could there be a system setup where you collect email addresses to send
> out a notice for the next release of LO,

in several countries that gets you to jail :-)

> or maybe add some simple
> function where if there is access to the Internet, it would look online
> for what version is available and tell the user that there is a new
> version out for them to try? It could be performed once a week,
> bi-weekly, or monthly. You would have to have both a function as part
> of LO and a data file online that shows which version are currently in
> final release.

We already have it, it was activated again in LO 3.4.x or 3.5, and it
works, but its yield is more limited in that the notification works for
existing LibreOffice users. If you have a copy of OpenOffice.org no
software notification will tell you that there's LibreOffice out there.

Best,
Charles.

>
> For those of you that use the latest version of Linux, I hope your
> repositories will reflect the newest LO version within a month of the
> release. I still use Ubuntu 10.04 on most of my systems, so its
> repository still used the old OOo 3.x as its default office package. I
> do have a Ubuntu 12.04/MATE install on a laptop, but I do not use it often.
>
>
>
> On 06/17/2012 07:49 AM, Charles-H. Schulz wrote:
> > Marc,
> >
> > The brand name and the automatic upda notification do help, obviously.
> >
> > Best,
> >
> > Charles.
> > Le 17 juin 2012 11:05, "Marc Paré"<[hidden email]> a écrit :
> >
> >> FYI (for those who are interested) -- From the latest SourceForge
> >> newsletter
> >>
> >> "Fastest Growing Projects
> >> Each month I get a report of the fastest growing projects for the month.
> >> Often, they contain an equal mix of familiar and new. This usually means
> >> that the familiar projects have pushed out a new release, and that the new
> >> projects have been discovered by a new audience.
> >>
> >> This month, these are the top ten growth projects:
> >>
> >> Apache OpenOffice: A wonderful multiplatform and multilingual office suite.
> >>
> >> KeePass Password Safe: KeePass - A free open source password manager.
> >>
> >> aMSN: MSN compatible messenger application. ..."
> >>
> >> Cheers,
> >>
> >> Marc
> >>
> >>
> >> --
> >> Unsubscribe instructions: E-mail to marketing+help@global.**
> >> libreoffice.org<marketing%[hidden email]>
> >> Problems? http://www.libreoffice.org/**get-help/mailing-lists/how-to-**
> >> unsubscribe/<http://www.libreoffice.org/get-help/mailing-lists/how-to-unsubscribe/>
> >> Posting guidelines + more: http://wiki.**documentfoundation.org/**
> >> Netiquette<http://wiki.documentfoundation.org/Netiquette>
> >> List archive: http://listarchives.**libreoffice.org/global/**marketing/<http://listarchives.libreoffice.org/global/marketing/>
> >> All messages sent to this list will be publicly archived and cannot be
> >> deleted
> >>
> >>
>
>

--
Charles-H. Schulz
Co-Founder & Director, The Document Foundation,
Zimmerstr. 69, 10117 Berlin, Germany
Rechtsfähige Stiftung des bürgerlichen Rechts
Legal details: http://www.documentfoundation.org/imprint

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Charles-H. Schulz

Re: Latest newsletter from SourceForge re: AOO

In reply to this post by timofonic timofonic

Hi,

Le dimanche 17 juin 2012 à 16:18 +0200, timofonic timofonic a écrit :
> Obviously, AOSS has the obvious corporatocracy advantages of the big
> ones. They will play with marketing tricks all the time, because big
> corps are hypocrite and want to destroy Free Software in a parasite
> way and consider non-bsd copyleft (GPL, LGPL...) as the enemy to
> monopolies and they are really true.
>

I'm not sure I'm agreeing with your statement, we have major
corporations backing The Document Foundation as well :-) As for the
licensing we believe that copyleft is better, and without "believing"
there is ample evidence that copyleft licensing worked very well to
attract new and existing developers to LibreOffice. That being said, I
also think no one has the only Truth out there.

> So the best way of LibreOffice to fight is to show it's a lot better
> project, able to satisfy a very wider audience that even may not be
> commercially interesting for big corps. I say not just features, but
> also getting it optimized to run on low end platforms (or old
> computers) and others.
>
> Another good thing is to make a code sharing alliance with other
> copyleft office suites or word processors, specially in the matter of
> file format support. This way, more people would collaborate on having
> an *A LOT* better support of Microsoft Office file formats (for
> example).
>
> LibreOffice competitors aren't just Microsoft Office, but AOO and
> other office suites and word processors. So forces should be joined,
> to make the free software office suite and word processing ecosystem
> stronger.

Well, keep in mind that AOO and LibreOffice both promote the ODF file
format and that because of this we are our should be happy
"co-opetitors" :-) I don't think there should be any sort of hatred
feelings towards AOO. It's important to know why AOO came into
existence, it's good to understand why they're doing what they're doing,
but besides that AOO is an existing open source project, with its
defects and its good sides . We -the community who went away from the
existing OpenOffice.org project because we knew that project was doomed,
and were right all along- know that what we did was the right thing, are
happy where we are, and our door is always open. Outside of that, people
are free to do whatever they want, esp. with software.

Best,
Charles.

>
> Of course, guerrilla marketing is the best way. Worldwide meetings,
> collaboration with NGOs, free LibreOffice courses...
>
> On Sun, Jun 17, 2012 at 3:33 PM, webmaster-Kracked_P_P
> <[hidden email]> wrote:
> >
> > Is it true that AOO is not going to have the same numbering system for its
> > version, like LO is using? I have seen "advertisements" for AOO in articles
> > that talk about AOO v4. If they skip all of the 3's and go to the version
> > name "4", then it may look like LO is behind them, when it was LO who moved
> > far ahead of them in the past year.
> >
> > Could there be a system setup where you collect email addresses to send out
> > a notice for the next release of LO, or maybe add some simple function where
> > if there is access to the Internet, it would look online for what version is
> > available and tell the user that there is a new version out for them to try?
> > It could be performed once a week, bi-weekly, or monthly. You would have
> > to have both a function as part of LO and a data file online that shows
> > which version are currently in final release.
> >
> > For those of you that use the latest version of Linux, I hope your
> > repositories will reflect the newest LO version within a month of the
> > release. I still use Ubuntu 10.04 on most of my systems, so its repository
> > still used the old OOo 3.x as its default office package. I do have a
> > Ubuntu 12.04/MATE install on a laptop, but I do not use it often.
> >
> >
> >
> >
> > On 06/17/2012 07:49 AM, Charles-H. Schulz wrote:
> >>
> >> Marc,
> >>
> >> The brand name and the automatic upda notification do help, obviously.
> >>
> >> Best,
> >>
> >> Charles.
> >> Le 17 juin 2012 11:05, "Marc Paré"<[hidden email]> a écrit :
> >>
> >>> FYI (for those who are interested) -- From the latest SourceForge
> >>> newsletter
> >>>
> >>> "Fastest Growing Projects
> >>> Each month I get a report of the fastest growing projects for the month.
> >>> Often, they contain an equal mix of familiar and new. This usually means
> >>> that the familiar projects have pushed out a new release, and that the
> >>> new
> >>> projects have been discovered by a new audience.
> >>>
> >>> This month, these are the top ten growth projects:
> >>>
> >>> Apache OpenOffice: A wonderful multiplatform and multilingual office
> >>> suite.
> >>>
> >>> KeePass Password Safe: KeePass - A free open source password manager.
> >>>
> >>> aMSN: MSN compatible messenger application. ..."
> >>>
> >>> Cheers,
> >>>
> >>> Marc
> >>>
> >>>
> >>> --
> >>> Unsubscribe instructions: E-mail to marketing+help@global.**
> >>> libreoffice.org<marketing%[hidden email]>
> >>> Problems? http://www.libreoffice.org/**get-help/mailing-lists/how-to-**
> >>>
> >>> unsubscribe/<http://www.libreoffice.org/get-help/mailing-lists/how-to-unsubscribe/>
> >>> Posting guidelines + more: http://wiki.**documentfoundation.org/**
> >>> Netiquette<http://wiki.documentfoundation.org/Netiquette>
> >>> List archive:
> >>> http://listarchives.**libreoffice.org/global/**marketing/<http://listarchives.libreoffice.org/global/marketing/>
> >>> All messages sent to this list will be publicly archived and cannot be
> >>> deleted
> >>>
> >>>
> >
> >
> > --
> > Unsubscribe instructions: E-mail to [hidden email]
> > Problems?
> > http://www.libreoffice.org/get-help/mailing-lists/how-to-unsubscribe/
> > Posting guidelines + more: http://wiki.documentfoundation.org/Netiquette
> > List archive: http://listarchives.libreoffice.org/global/marketing/
> > All messages sent to this list will be publicly archived and cannot be
> > deleted
> >
>

Tom

Re: Latest newsletter from SourceForge re: AOO

In reply to this post by Charles-H. Schulz

Hi :)
I think it is good that AOO is aiming for corporate organisations. LibreOffice is not ready and is unlikely to be able to make the changes required quickly. If each suite has it's niche then we hopefully cover all the bases between us.
Regards from
Tom :)

--- On Sun, 17/6/12, Charles-H. Schulz <[hidden email]> wrote:

From: Charles-H. Schulz <[hidden email]>
Subject: Re: [libreoffice-marketing] Latest newsletter from SourceForge re: AOO
To: [hidden email]
Date: Sunday, 17 June, 2012, 12:49

Marc,

The brand name and the automatic upda notification do help, obviously.

Best,

Charles.
Le 17 juin 2012 11:05, "Marc Paré" <[hidden email]> a écrit :

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Florian Effenberger

Re: Latest newsletter from SourceForge re: AOO

Hi,

Tom Davies wrote on 2012-06-18 10:55:

> I think it is good that AOO is aiming for corporate organisations. LibreOffice is not ready and is unlikely to be able to make the changes required quickly.

why do you think LibreOffice is not ready for corporate adaption? Facts
tell otherwise :-)

Florian

--
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Tel: +49 8341 99660880 | Mobile: +49 151 14424108
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Tom

Re: Latest newsletter from SourceForge re: AOO

Hi :)
The thread about stability which then got hijacked into talking about long-term-support (LTS).

For stability we mostly seemed to accept that we run 2 branches in order that
1. the older branch is more stable and
2. the newer one has more features.

I was told i was unreasonable to think that adding new features might not lead to regressions and unexpected problems. Apparently however stable the newer branch is the older one has focussed on bug-patches and fixes and is therefore likely to be more stable than the early sub-point versions of a newer branch.

The result was that you would ignore the advantages of newer branches and just tell people that the newer branches earliest releases were the most stable releases.

As for LTS it was decided that any project would find it unfeasable to keep providing bug-patches and security updates even for a couple of years if it was to continue developing newer releases at the same time.

Regards from
Tom :)

--- On Mon, 18/6/12, Florian Effenberger <[hidden email]> wrote:

From: Florian Effenberger <[hidden email]>
Subject: Re: [libreoffice-marketing] Latest newsletter from SourceForge re: AOO
To: [hidden email]
Date: Monday, 18 June, 2012, 9:58

Hi,

Tom Davies wrote on 2012-06-18 10:55:

> I think it is good that AOO is aiming for corporate organisations. LibreOffice is not ready and is unlikely to be able to make the changes required quickly.

why do you think LibreOffice is not ready for corporate adaption? Facts tell otherwise :-)

Florian

-- Florian Effenberger, Chairman of the Board
Tel: +49 8341 99660880 | Mobile: +49 151 14424108
The Document Foundation, Zimmerstr. 69, 10117 Berlin, Germany
Rechtsfähige Stiftung des bürgerlichen Rechts
Legal details: http://www.documentfoundation.org/imprint

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Florian Effenberger

Re: Latest newsletter from SourceForge re: AOO

Hi,

Tom Davies wrote on 2012-06-18 11:22:
> The thread about stability which then got hijacked into talking about long-term-support (LTS).

and that makes you think LibreOffice is unsuitable for corporate
deployment, but Apache, who just released one version so far, with no
details on LTS plannings, are suitable? Strange perception. ;-)

I agree that we can improve things on our side, we always can do that,
but claiming LibreOffice is not suitable for corporations is simply
painfully wrong.

Florian

--
Florian Effenberger, Chairman of the Board
Tel: +49 8341 99660880 | Mobile: +49 151 14424108
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Tom

Re: Latest newsletter from SourceForge re: AOO

Hi :)
I think that the definitive rulings made by BoD members in that thread suggest that LO is not ready for corporate uptake yet.

LO's definition of stable seems to be about the opposite of most people's definition. LO appears to think something is stable when something is so new that no-one has yet found the problems that we know we can expect when a ton of exciting new features have been added.

By not releasing so often AOO seems less likely to add regressions and new problems. Unfortunately they will still be stuck with old problems that LO has already solved but at least most of those are known issues.

At least AOO has not ruled-out the types of things that corporate organisations are likely to want in the way that LO has.
Regards from
Tom :)

--- On Mon, 18/6/12, Florian Effenberger <[hidden email]> wrote:

From: Florian Effenberger <[hidden email]>
Subject: Re: [libreoffice-marketing] Latest newsletter from SourceForge re: AOO
To: [hidden email]
Date: Monday, 18 June, 2012, 10:25

Hi,

Tom Davies wrote on 2012-06-18 11:22:
> The thread about stability which then got hijacked into talking about long-term-support (LTS).

and that makes you think LibreOffice is unsuitable for corporate deployment, but Apache, who just released one version so far, with no details on LTS plannings, are suitable? Strange perception. ;-)

I agree that we can improve things on our side, we always can do that, but claiming LibreOffice is not suitable for corporations is simply painfully wrong.

Florian

-- Florian Effenberger, Chairman of the Board
Tel: +49 8341 99660880 | Mobile: +49 151 14424108
The Document Foundation, Zimmerstr. 69, 10117 Berlin, Germany
Rechtsfähige Stiftung des bürgerlichen Rechts
Legal details: http://www.documentfoundation.org/imprint

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Cor Nouws

Re: Latest newsletter from SourceForge re: AOO

Hi,

My customers hate (some) bugs as much as I and we all do. Still, they
don't dump computers :-)

My customers want better compatibility with .docx, xlsx, and pptx.
They want a faster Calc, a Base that works, import of Visio, and so on.
They want a office suite that is preparing itself for the future and
faster solving of bugs.
Guess what they want ..

It seems as if Tom doesn't know well enough what he is talking about.
Which if course is a pity when he is taking such strong positions on the
marketing list.

Tom Davies wrote (18-06-12 11:59)
> [...]

--
- Cor
- http://nl.libreoffice.org

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Florian Effenberger

Re: Latest newsletter from SourceForge re: AOO

In reply to this post by Tom

Hi,

Tom Davies wrote on 2012-06-18 11:59:
> I think that the definitive rulings made by BoD members in that thread suggest that LO is not ready for corporate uptake yet.

it seems we have a rather different view on this here, and I can back
mine with facts. :-)

Florian

--
Florian Effenberger, Chairman of the Board
Tel: +49 8341 99660880 | Mobile: +49 151 14424108
The Document Foundation, Zimmerstr. 69, 10117 Berlin, Germany
Rechtsfähige Stiftung des bürgerlichen Rechts
Legal details: http://www.documentfoundation.org/imprint

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Tom

Re: Latest newsletter from SourceForge re: AOO

Hi :)
If the 'proof' is that several large organisations have committed themselves to LO then MSO has 'proven' itself far better because far more and larger organisations use it and they have stuck with it for longer. Personally, of course, i think that type of 'proof' is deeply flawed. However, lets just see how many organisations switch away from LO within a year or two.

Of course Cor makes good points. There are tons of advantages with every new release, especially the .0s. Those are the advantages that should be cited when telling people about the advantages of LO generally and the newer branches in particular.

Regards from
Tom :)

--- On Mon, 18/6/12, Florian Effenberger <[hidden email]> wrote:

From: Florian Effenberger <[hidden email]>
Subject: Re: [libreoffice-marketing] Latest newsletter from SourceForge re: AOO
To: [hidden email]
Date: Monday, 18 June, 2012, 11:22

Hi,

Tom Davies wrote on 2012-06-18 11:59:
> I think that the definitive rulings made by BoD members in that thread suggest that LO is not ready for corporate uptake yet.

it seems we have a rather different view on this here, and I can back mine with facts. :-)

Florian

-- Florian Effenberger, Chairman of the Board
Tel: +49 8341 99660880 | Mobile: +49 151 14424108
The Document Foundation, Zimmerstr. 69, 10117 Berlin, Germany
Rechtsfähige Stiftung des bürgerlichen Rechts
Legal details: http://www.documentfoundation.org/imprint

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Tom

Re: Latest newsletter from SourceForge re: AOO

In reply to this post by Cor Nouws

Hi :)
The way i see it is that LO always has 2 products.

Lets take LO's equivalent of fine red wine in a market where everyone else is restricted to only being able to produce beer. LOs strategy is to claim that it's red wine is "low alcohol" (because wine is about 12% whereas whiskey is far higher). Meanwhile LO is also offering freshly squeezed fruit juice but it never mentions about that until you dig around the back of the shop.

Regards from
Tom :)

--- On Mon, 18/6/12, Cor Nouws <[hidden email]> wrote:

From: Cor Nouws <[hidden email]>
Subject: Re: [libreoffice-marketing] Latest newsletter from SourceForge re: AOO
To: [hidden email]
Date: Monday, 18 June, 2012, 11:21

Hi,

My customers hate (some) bugs as much as I and we all do. Still, they don't dump computers :-)

My customers want better compatibility with .docx, xlsx, and pptx.
They want a faster Calc, a Base that works, import of Visio, and so on.
They want a office suite that is preparing itself for the future and faster solving of bugs.
Guess what they want ..

It seems as if Tom doesn't know well enough what he is talking about.
Which if course is a pity when he is taking such strong positions on the marketing list.

Tom Davies wrote (18-06-12 11:59)
> [...]

-- - Cor
- http://nl.libreoffice.org

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timofonic timofonic

Re: Latest newsletter from SourceForge re: AOO

Hello Tom...

Are you a developer? Why using so much analogies? Could you provide
strong facts instead? Please, this is boring and time wasting. It
seems like you only want to be polemical and grow the controversy, but
I hope to be wrong about it. If you say about stable and pre-release
versions, that's a common software releasing way and I don't see your
point here. If you want to discuss the philosophy behind the LO
development model and how to improve it, I think that's a better task
for developers.

I agree about better file format support (I still think a code sharing
alliance with other projects must be done to make things easier), code
efficiency optimization, constantly improving the code quality, more
robust code and more open about expanding the project to other needs.

What would "corporate" want? Well, certain corporations like IBM seem
to want to take the full control of the project in a proxy way (and
form a corporately controlled community over it, just like Sun tried
with OpenSolaris and OpenOffice too). Apache is quite passive in that
regard and they adopt corporate owned technologies like Java, in my
opinion (and they become some kind of low cost subcontracted
organization to manage the development). But other corporations "just"
want an a lot lower cost software that meets all their needs (just as
the Linux kernel is for tons of them) and that's the interesting ones
to join forces with.

Look at Linux Foundation, they managed the equilibrium and still the
kernel is one of the most used pieces of code as basis for tons of
devices from embedded to clusters. Even Linus these days is becoming
grumpy about the years of damaging Nvidia attitude (no hardware
programming documentation, tons of binary blobs and not just related
to their graphics chips...), despite his non-correct political
attitude quite common from the rebel way of the hacker philosophy.

About friendly corporations, I think this must be formalized in a
dynamical and pragmatic way but also with a good set of lawyers. They
must be formal members of the community in a similar way that Linux
Foundation does with corps :)

Regards.

On Mon, Jun 18, 2012 at 1:15 PM, Tom Davies <[hidden email]> wrote:

> Hi :)
> The way i see it is that LO always has 2 products.
>
> Lets take LO's equivalent of fine red wine in a market where everyone else is restricted to only being able to produce beer. LOs strategy is to claim that it's red wine is "low alcohol" (because wine is about 12% whereas whiskey is far higher). Meanwhile LO is also offering freshly squeezed fruit juice but it never mentions about that until you dig around the back of the shop.
>
> Regards from
> Tom :)
>
>
> --- On Mon, 18/6/12, Cor Nouws <[hidden email]> wrote:
>
> From: Cor Nouws <[hidden email]>
> Subject: Re: [libreoffice-marketing] Latest newsletter from SourceForge re: AOO
> To: [hidden email]
> Date: Monday, 18 June, 2012, 11:21
>
> Hi,
>
> My customers hate (some) bugs as much as I and we all do. Still, they don't dump computers :-)
>
> My customers want better compatibility with .docx, xlsx, and pptx.
> They want a faster Calc, a Base that works, import of Visio, and so on.
> They want a office suite that is preparing itself for the future and faster solving of bugs.
> Guess what they want ..
>
> It seems as if Tom doesn't know well enough what he is talking about.
> Which if course is a pity when he is taking such strong positions on the marketing list.
>
> Tom Davies wrote (18-06-12 11:59)
>> [...]
>
>
>
> -- - Cor
> - http://nl.libreoffice.org
>
>
> -- Unsubscribe instructions: E-mail to [hidden email]
> Problems? http://www.libreoffice.org/get-help/mailing-lists/how-to-unsubscribe/
> Posting guidelines + more: http://wiki.documentfoundation.org/Netiquette
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> All messages sent to this list will be publicly archived and cannot be deleted
>
>
> --
> Unsubscribe instructions: E-mail to [hidden email]
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> All messages sent to this list will be publicly archived and cannot be deleted
>

krackedpress

Re: Latest newsletter from SourceForge re: AOO

Why not solve this issue on "stable" or not in a different thread.

How about the BoD come up with a marketing statement[s] that the local
people can use to promote LO to businesses, non-profit organizations,
colleges and other schools, and individual users.

We need some material we can take to these different type of users that
has been professionally made and that will give the users all the facts
about LO and why they should use it instead of MSO, and maybe AOO.

I would like to have a marketing package that I could hand out copies to
the IT people and their bosses, so they have a professional
presentation/material to help evaluate and hopefully choose LO for their
organization.

I am not a marketing expert. I do not have a sales background. I bet
most of the local people who want to promote LO in their areas are in
the same boat as I am.

What we need is the marketing materials, including fact sheets, to be
able to provide the needed information to potential users, business or
other, on the advantages of using LO's free open source office package.

I would like to be able to have something beside my opinion on LO to
offer these potential users. LO has been around for over a year, but
there is still not good marketing resources available for us local users
to promote LO to business in our area.

Please get a marketing plan and the copyable materials available to us
local/regional promoters.

On 06/18/2012 07:52 AM, timofonic timofonic wrote:

> Hello Tom...
>
> Are you a developer? Why using so much analogies? Could you provide
> strong facts instead? Please, this is boring and time wasting. It
> seems like you only want to be polemical and grow the controversy, but
> I hope to be wrong about it. If you say about stable and pre-release
> versions, that's a common software releasing way and I don't see your
> point here. If you want to discuss the philosophy behind the LO
> development model and how to improve it, I think that's a better task
> for developers.
>
> I agree about better file format support (I still think a code sharing
> alliance with other projects must be done to make things easier), code
> efficiency optimization, constantly improving the code quality, more
> robust code and more open about expanding the project to other needs.
>
> What would "corporate" want? Well, certain corporations like IBM seem
> to want to take the full control of the project in a proxy way (and
> form a corporately controlled community over it, just like Sun tried
> with OpenSolaris and OpenOffice too). Apache is quite passive in that
> regard and they adopt corporate owned technologies like Java, in my
> opinion (and they become some kind of low cost subcontracted
> organization to manage the development). But other corporations "just"
> want an a lot lower cost software that meets all their needs (just as
> the Linux kernel is for tons of them) and that's the interesting ones
> to join forces with.
>
> Look at Linux Foundation, they managed the equilibrium and still the
> kernel is one of the most used pieces of code as basis for tons of
> devices from embedded to clusters. Even Linus these days is becoming
> grumpy about the years of damaging Nvidia attitude (no hardware
> programming documentation, tons of binary blobs and not just related
> to their graphics chips...), despite his non-correct political
> attitude quite common from the rebel way of the hacker philosophy.
>
> About friendly corporations, I think this must be formalized in a
> dynamical and pragmatic way but also with a good set of lawyers. They
> must be formal members of the community in a similar way that Linux
> Foundation does with corps :)
>
> Regards.
>
>
>
> On Mon, Jun 18, 2012 at 1:15 PM, Tom Davies<[hidden email]> wrote:
>> Hi :)
>> The way i see it is that LO always has 2 products.
>>
>> Lets take LO's equivalent of fine red wine in a market where everyone else is restricted to only being able to produce beer. LOs strategy is to claim that it's red wine is "low alcohol" (because wine is about 12% whereas whiskey is far higher). Meanwhile LO is also offering freshly squeezed fruit juice but it never mentions about that until you dig around the back of the shop.
>>
>> Regards from
>> Tom :)
>>
>>
>> --- On Mon, 18/6/12, Cor Nouws<[hidden email]> wrote:
>>
>> From: Cor Nouws<[hidden email]>
>> Subject: Re: [libreoffice-marketing] Latest newsletter from SourceForge re: AOO
>> To: [hidden email]
>> Date: Monday, 18 June, 2012, 11:21
>>
>> Hi,
>>
>> My customers hate (some) bugs as much as I and we all do. Still, they don't dump computers :-)
>>
>> My customers want better compatibility with .docx, xlsx, and pptx.
>> They want a faster Calc, a Base that works, import of Visio, and so on.
>> They want a office suite that is preparing itself for the future and faster solving of bugs.
>> Guess what they want ..
>>
>> It seems as if Tom doesn't know well enough what he is talking about.
>> Which if course is a pity when he is taking such strong positions on the marketing list.
>>
>> Tom Davies wrote (18-06-12 11:59)
>>> [...]
>>
>>
>> -- - Cor
>> - http://nl.libreoffice.org
>>
>>
>> -- Unsubscribe instructions: E-mail to [hidden email]
>> Problems? http://www.libreoffice.org/get-help/mailing-lists/how-to-unsubscribe/
>> Posting guidelines + more: http://wiki.documentfoundation.org/Netiquette
>> List archive: http://listarchives.libreoffice.org/global/marketing/
>> All messages sent to this list will be publicly archived and cannot be deleted
>>
>>
>> --
>> Unsubscribe instructions: E-mail to [hidden email]
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>> List archive: http://listarchives.libreoffice.org/global/marketing/
>> All messages sent to this list will be publicly archived and cannot be deleted
>>

Tom

Re: Latest newsletter from SourceForge re: AOO

In reply to this post by timofonic timofonic

Hi :)
Yes, the stable vs the pre-release is fairly common. Would you market a pre-release by saying it's only positive point is that it is "stable"?

The corporates being talked about are the ones whose main aims are outside of software development. Organisations such as hospitals, police forces, government agencies, stationery retailers, accountancy firms, travel companies, events organisers.

LO is already made from a number of different organisations such as openSUSE, Google, Redhat, Canonical (and on and on) who are able to get involved with writing code and taking LO in directions they want to go in.

The structure is already quite formalised with those companies being on an "Advisory Board" which is able to make recommendations and suggestions to the BoD. There are restrictions on the percentage of people on any of the boards being from any 1 organisation. All that sort of thing is pretty much done already although possibly some paper-work may need to be signed to cement the agreements they have made. TDF is not disorganised and has done a remarkable job of setting-up excellently well in a very short time.

Regards from
Tom :)

--- On Mon, 18/6/12, timofonic timofonic <[hidden email]> wrote:

From: timofonic timofonic <[hidden email]>
Subject: Re: [libreoffice-marketing] Latest newsletter from SourceForge re: AOO
To: [hidden email]
Date: Monday, 18 June, 2012, 12:52

Hello Tom...

Are you a developer? Why using so much analogies? Could you provide
strong facts instead? Please, this is boring and time wasting. It
seems like you only want to be polemical and grow the controversy, but
I hope to be wrong about it. If you say about stable and pre-release
versions, that's a common software releasing way and I don't see your
point here. If you want to discuss the philosophy behind the LO
development model and how to improve it, I think that's a better task
for developers.

I agree about better file format support (I still think a code sharing
alliance with other projects must be done to make things easier), code
efficiency optimization, constantly improving the code quality, more
robust code and more open about expanding the project to other needs.

What would "corporate" want? Well, certain corporations like IBM seem
to want to take the full control of the project in a proxy way (and
form a corporately controlled community over it, just like Sun tried
with OpenSolaris and OpenOffice too). Apache is quite passive in that
regard and they adopt corporate owned technologies like Java, in my
opinion (and they become some kind of low cost subcontracted
organization to manage the development). But other corporations "just"
want an a lot lower cost software that meets all their needs (just as
the Linux kernel is for tons of them) and that's the interesting ones
to join forces with.

Look at Linux Foundation, they managed the equilibrium and still the
kernel is one of the most used pieces of code as basis for tons of
devices from embedded to clusters. Even Linus these days is becoming
grumpy about the years of damaging Nvidia attitude (no hardware
programming documentation, tons of binary blobs and not just related
to their graphics chips...), despite his non-correct political
attitude quite common from the rebel way of the hacker philosophy.

About friendly corporations, I think this must be formalized in a
dynamical and pragmatic way but also with a good set of lawyers. They
must be formal members of the community in a similar way that Linux
Foundation does with corps :)

Regards.

On Mon, Jun 18, 2012 at 1:15 PM, Tom Davies <[hidden email]> wrote: